Our guest this month is Sarah Monette, author of The Bone Key, which is just out in its shiny second edition with an introduction by Lynne M. Thomas (astute listeners may remember her as the guest on last month’s OA podcast). After the interview, Sarah also reads an excerpt from one of the stories in The Bone Key.

Annnnnnd…

She’s graciously donated a signed copy for our birthday giveaway, and we have two other books as well! Signed copies of Vintage by Steve Berman, and Hollowstone by Dennis Upkins are also up for grabs. Three lucky listeners will win one of these haunting tomes. The contest is open until the end of November. I’ll draw winners in December. To enter, send me an e-mail (julia@juliarios.com) with “Podcast Contest” in the subject line. I will ship anywhere in the world, and everyone who is not actually me is eligible. This means you!

You can subscribe to the podcast RSS feed here or use this link to subscribe with iTunes. You can also hit play on the embedded player in this post and listen to the podcast on the web, or visit the individual episode page to download this episode as an MP3 without subscribing

Notes:

News
*Malinda Lo has redesigned her website, and is also giving away books to celebrate!
*The World Fantasy Awards happened last month, and Alisa Krasnostein won in the Special Award Non-Professional category for Twelfth Planet Press. Hurray! If you would like to read some awesome Australian specfic (often with queer content), Twelfth Planet Press is a great place to look!
*The Tiptree Recommended Reading List  is full of awesome stories, many of which are by OA members! There is still time to recommend books and stories to the Tiptree jury, so if you’ve read something this year which explores or expands our notions of gender, do go tell them about it!
*Maria Lima‘s Bood Sacrifice has been nominated in the Best Urban Fantasy Protagonist category for the RT Awards! Hurray, and best of luck to you, Maria!
*It’s [Inter]National Novel Writing Month! Bon Courage to all the wrimos in the OA crowd!
*Dennis Upkins will be signing books at The Great Escape in Madison, TN on the 19th of this month
*Sarah Monette will be signing books on that very same day (with Elizabeth Bear) at Pandemonium Books in Cambridge, MA.

Sarah’s Work
*The Bone Key and Somewhere Beneath Those Waves are her two short story collections, available from Prime Books.
*“After the Dragon” and “The Devil in Gaylord’s Creek” are the two stories we talked about that appeared in Fantasy Magazine.
*“Letter From a Teddy Bear on Veteran’s Day” is one of the first stories Sarah successfully wrote (the other is the opening story in The Bone Key, “Bringing Helena Back”).
*Here is Sarah Monette’s Author Page on Amazon, where you can find all of her novels.

Other Works We Mentioned
*The Turn of the Screw by Henry James
*“Oh, Whistle and I’ll Come to You, My Lad” and “The Wailing Well” by M.R. James
*“The Statement of Randolph Carter” by H.P. Lovecraft (the inspiration for “Bringing Helena Back”)
*“The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath” by H.P. Lovecraft (Sarah’s favorite Lovecraft story)
*The Dead Zone by Stephen King (in Sarah’s estimation, one of the greatest novels of the twentieth century)
*P.G. Wodehouse (whose work, like Sarah’s Booth stories, features eccentric characters with strong personalities)
*Swordspoint by Ellen Kushner (which Sarah says is a huge influence on her fantasy novels)

That’s it for this episode. If you have feedback for me, please leave a comment here, talk to us on the Google Group, or e-mail me at julia@juliarios.com. And do enter to win one of the three books in our Birthday Ghost Story Giveaway!

Earlier this week over at Genreville, Rose Fox lent her blog to Sherwood Smith and Rachel Manija Brown so that they could share their experience submitting a post-apocalyptic YA novel with a gay point of view character. They wrote about how an agent offered them representation if they’d change that character to make him straight.

Rose asked for honest conversation, and in the days since that post went live, I’ve seen hundreds of responses. Several agents and editors have publicly said they’re open to/actively hoping to see LGBTQIA content in their submissions piles, a representative from the agency in question responded claiming it had all been a misunderstanding, the #YesGayYA hashtag on Twitter took off and was full of recommendations and discussion, and many people have taken this as another prompt to point out their favorite YA books with non-straight characters. So that’s all good and happy and we’re done, right?

Not so fast.

As Sherwood and Rachel pointed out in their first post (in which, I note, they deliberately chose not to name the agent in question so as to focus on the larger problem):

Forcing all major characters in YA novels into a straight white mold is a widespread, systemic problem which requires long-term, consistent action.

In their personal blogs, in response to the agency’s post, they add:

This is why we went public: After the initial exchange a month ago, we spoke in private to a number of other writers, without mentioning the name of the agent or agency. There was an overwhelming response of “Me too!” Many other writers had been asked by agents and editors to alter or remove the minority identity of their characters, sometimes as a condition of representation or sale. Sometimes those identities had been altered by editors without the writers’ knowledge or permission.

…

We urge you all to continue focusing on the bigger picture.

The bigger picture does seem to be something everyone involved professes to care about, so let’s take a look at it.

Not every author has major trouble around this kind of thing. Malinda Lo‘s Ash, a retelling of Cinderella in which the main character happens to be a lesbian (and no one in her world thinks that’s strange or anything!), seems to have had a fairly easy road to publication, for instance. This spring, she wrote a long post about how little homophobia she’s had to deal with in her professional life. In that post, she pointed out the difference between personal homophobia and cold hard marketing numbers crunching. Then, this week, she crunched some numbers and made some colorful graphs and charts. These numbers are encouraging in some ways, and very discouraging in others.

Encouraging:

*All the major publishing houses consistently put out at least one YA book with LGBTQIA main or supporting characters each year.

*The numbers dropped sharply in 2010, but rose again in 2011.

*There has been at least one trans or genderqueer character each year.

Discouraging:

*The number of YA books with LGBTQIA main or major supporting characters comprises less than or about 1% of all the YA books out there. Now, the lowest estimates I usually see about LGBTQIA people tend to say that we make up about 10% of the general population. If that’s correct, 1% is a rather low representation.

*Of the LGBTQIA YA books out there, 50% are about gay males. This means Lesbians, bi people of all genders, genderqueer, trans, questioning, asexual, and intersex people are even more under-represented in YA than gay males.

*Very few of these books feature LGBTQIA characters as the protagonist of the book. Many have LGBTQIA supporting young characters (the gay best friend, etc.), or parent/guardian characters instead.

*Many of the books with LGBTQIA characters as the protagonist are Issue Books. That is to say, they’re about the struggles associated with accepting one’s gender identity and/or sexual orientation. While these kinds of books are good to have around, by being the overwhelming majority of this tiny subset of YA books, they’re also contributing to a general sense that LGBTQIA people are not normal. If all queer stories feature people trying to accept their LGBTQIA identities, then what we’re saying as a society, is that having an LGBTQIA identity is something that isn’t easily acceptable. Do we really want to be telling ourselves that? What I hear over and over from members of the community is that we’d love to see more books where people are queer as a matter of course and not as an issue which requires great personal struggles. I think many of us would love to see more books like Ash, in which the protagonist’s orientation is not an issue, and her journey is about more than coming out or learning to accept her identity.

*Out of the eleven LGBTQIA YA books on Malinda’s list, which were published in 2010, only one was a specfic book.  YA is a major market for specfic. In almost every bookstore I’ve gone into in the last two years, there’ve been separate sections for non-specfic YA and specfic YA, because there was just so much YA specfic out there. So the fact that only one book on that 2010 list is a specfic book? Is really sad to me. I haven’t counted the other years. Maybe they’re better. But I’m betting the numbers are still pretty low.

Below are a few collected responses to this debate:

Seanan McGuire (AKA Mira Grant) wrote a great post about what she wants to see in fiction.

When I talk about wanting diversity in my YA, I’m not asking for more specifically “queer YA.” I love it, I want to see it keep getting published, I think it’s important, and I think it’s not the point of this particular sword. What I want is paranormal romance where the lead is in love with the head cheerleader, not the head jock. What I want is heist books and con men where it’s Mike and Dan, not Mike and Dawn.

Nicola Griffith wrote a post and included a video of her telling the story of her struggles getting attention for her book, Slow River.

I think just about every queer author has been through this. I imagine people of colour go through it, too. We all choose whether or not to walk away. I dealt with this in 1994–instantly, satisfyingly (though it was a jaw-dropping shock).

Dennis Upkins wrote a post, which supported Nicola’s musing about people of color facing under-representation.

Do you honestly think this was an isolated incident or these kind of attitudes are happening in a vacuum?

This is most pervasive of the industry as a whole.

Ask yourself how many novels there are out there in mainstream speculative fiction that feature LGBTQs, particularly gay males, as the primary protagonists? For that matter ask yourselves how many mainstream speculative novels feature POCs, or better yet how many feature queer POCs.

Corinne Duyvis posted a roundup of arguments and counter arguments about this issue (well worth reading all of them if you have the time).

One point I did want to make–and something I’ve seen most people echo, thankfully–is that the agent’s reasons for requesting these changes don’t matter. whatever her personal biases or lack thereof, requesting a change like this contributes to the marginalization of an already underrepresented group.

Scott Tracey posted about his experience getting his book with a gay protagonist, Witch Eyes, published.

I don’t like to talk about it, because I still feel like someone’s going to come and rap my knuckles with a ruler, but WITCH EYES had it’s moments.  I had agents who said there wasn’t a market for a paranormal with a gay character who had a romance.  I had editors suggest they would reconsider the book if Braden and Trey became Brenda and Trey.  Or if I removed the romance and made it a straight girl/gay guy buddy comedy.

Scott asks us to buy more LGBTQIA YA if we want to see more published. I think that’s a really important thing to do, but it only works if we have LGBTQIA YA books available to buy.Which brings us to our ending point for today.

Rick Lipman wrote a post about his experiences being a young queer reader and writer. His ending words bring us straight to the heart of this issue:

Listen. I am not that old. When I was growing up, there were no gay characters. And then, when there were, it was Will & Grace and Queer Eye for the Straight Guy. I did not get to see people like me in books, or on television, or as superheroes. We were not mainstream. We were not acceptable or appropriate for public consumption.

I’m 24 years old. Times have changed a lot in recent years, but to act like there isn’t still a long road of progress ahead is arrogance, plain and simple. I didn’t grow up with role models or stories of my own.

It is unconscionable to me that teens today may still be in the same position.

I’m going to leave it there for today, but I welcome further discussion. I’m not particularly interested in attacks on or defenses of Sherwood, Rachel, or the agency in question, though. I’d rather we keep this discussion to the larger issue, because this isn’t about three people; it’s about all of us.

We have yet another controversy rocking the queer specfic community this week. It’s one I have reservations talking about, but I know it’s deeply important to a lot of our membership that the OA addresses it, and I do understand and support that sentiment, so here I am.

Three years ago, Tor published a collection of novellas, which included one by Orson Scott Card. He retold Hamlet. I didn’t hear about it at the time. By then I’d already stopped buying books by Card, or submitting work to his publication, because I knew that our fundamental values were at odds. He’s publicly said many times things that indicate that he doesn’t support LGBTQI rights, and believes a lot of things I find offensive and damaging. Now, my personal response to that has been to ignore him. He has the right to say what he wishes, because we both live in a time and place where freedom of speech is a protected right. I have the right to speak out against him if I choose, but to date I’ve always felt that exercising that right would give his damaging viewpoint more attention, and I didn’t really want to do that.

People talk about honest reviews being good, and I agree. People have said that negative reviews can help boost sales, and I agree with that, too. I’ve bought books before because I read a review that made me sure I’d like them even though the reviewer didn’t. More than anything, reviews give books attention. I wouldn’t have known about this book if it hadn’t been for a review. I’m guessing a lot of other people wouldn’t have either. I worry that the fervor over it will lead to results other than what the protesters would hope. I know that I’m potentially fueling that unwanted attention by adding my voice to the conversation, and that unsettles me.

I’ve said before that it’s important not to attack people personally. I don’t wish to do that, and I won’t be doing that today. I’ve also said that it’s important to speak out against injustice, and important to educate people when we can. It is my hope that I will accomplish these things, and also that this post will serve as a part of an extended open dialogue with the specfic community at large.

Now, the review in question was in response to a reprint of Card’s Hamlet retelling, not the original Tor collection. The standalone novella came out this Spring from Subterranean Press. I was especially dismayed to hear that news, and to hear, in the first cries of outrage, people calling for a boycott of Subterranean. That particular press has often published great books and stories with queer content, and by queer authors. I’ve bought some of them, and always felt good about supporting an open-minded small press with really nice production values. Seriously, if you’ve ever bought a book from them, you’ll know that they use highest quality materials. Their art is usually great, and every time I receive one of their books, I feel a sense of tactile joy, because they understand about texture at Subterranean. Their books are a pleasure to hold.

When this all erupted in a flurry of passionate e-mails on the OA google group, I said that if I boycotted every publisher who ever put out something I found offensive, I’d severely limit my reading choices. Others asked why people hadn’t called for a boycott of Tor. Still others pointed out that this was a troubling reprint because it was specifically chosen by a small press, and we ought to demand to know Bill Schafer’s reasoning. Along with boycotting, demands for various other concessions floated about, but none seemed to unite everyone in agreement.

Then someone pointed out that it was in fact possible that Bill Schafer and others hadn’t realized how and why this story was offensive. People who have the privilege of not being targeted by these damaging tropes are often unaware of them. Indeed, Bill Schafer’s response to the whole thing indicates that this might have been the case for him. He asks for people to share their thoughts, and says that he’s listening. If all of this results in a publisher learning a little more about how and why works he publishes might actively hurt people, then I suppose it’s worth the risk of giving attention to an author I’d rather ignore. Here is a collection of accounts by OA members of their experiences with this particular controversy, followed by some recommendations of queer-positive Shakespeare stories.

Rose Fox summed up the whole sordid saga in a concise and comprehensive manner over on the Genreville blog.

[T]his is the thing about offensiveness grenades: they may look entirely inert for so long that you forget they’re dangerous, but sooner or later, they explode.

On the google group, Rose added the following:

I am really sad and disappointed that Subterranean Press and Tor Books, which publish many books by queer and trans authors and with queer themes, also published a novella that vilifies queer people and equates us with child molesters. I call on those publishers–and on all SF/F publishers, imprints, and magazines both large and small–to refrain from publishing books and stories that vilify any group of people in such a fashion.

Cheryl Morgan said much the same thing to me, and explained why this particular reprint is so upsetting:

There is, I think, a difference between publishing the story as part of a retrospective of Card’s work, which can put it in context, and publishing it has a high-priced collectors’ edition, which suggests it is something special and of extra value.

Elizabeth Schechter posted about her personal reaction on her blog:

To be honest, right now, I’m more at the stage of sputter…sputter… whiskey  tango FOXTROT???

And my reaction isn’t because Card wrote this. Anyone who is following along and playing Homophobic Bingo: the Home Game just maxed out their score. This is no surprise.

The surprise is that Subterranean Press published it.

River Willow Fagan posted an extremely brave and heartfelt open letter to Bill Schafer, explaining how and why this kind of thing damages people:

One of the most painful aspects of being a queer survivor has been the doubts: what if all those hateful voices were right?  What if I am attracted to men because my father abused me?  What if I really am sick, what if my soul really is twisted and broken like all those conservative Christians say?

Sunny Moraine called for people to demand better stories, and posited that small-mindedness leads to bad writing:

I think that it’s important to recognize that art can be really offensive and still have a huge amount of value. But I also think that believing stupid, hateful things – more often than not – makes you a bad artist. As it cripples and stunts your mind and heart and spirit, it cripples and stunts the things that your mind and heart and spirit produce.

Brandon Bell, talking of the demands for more good queer stories, noted:

I’m certainly happy to see queer-themed Shakespearean works at Fantastique Unfettered.

Angela Korra’ti expressed a hope that people would not buy the book now that it has received more attention, and offfered a few alternatives for people who want good queer retellings of old stories:

So to all of you who never knew about this work, I’m a bit sorry to have brought it to your attention, and can only hope you will continue to not only not buy it, but will specifically not buy it because bigotry is not okay. To those of you who already knew about it and elected not to buy it on that basis, I thank you.

To counter its existence, I’d like to commend to your attention the Lethe Press anthology Time Well Bent, in which Catherine Lundoff has a story in which Shakespeare isn’t queer, but his sister Judith is–and so is his friend Kit Marlowe. Hayden Thorne has Arabesque, a dark m/m adaptation of Snow White. And I’ve mentioned this one already, but it’s worth mentioning again in a post whose theme is “adaptations of classic stories”: i.e., Ash by Malinda Lo.

Several people recommended Elizabeth Bear’s Spectrum Award winning Stratford Man duology. Warren Rochelle, one of the judges for the award, shared his thoughts about the books alongside some quotes from the official Spectrum Award writeup:

Ink and Steel and Hell and Earth, the two volumes in Elizabeth Bear’s duology, “were far and away the work most deserving of our award for the year.” I was quite taken by this universe in which Shakespeare and his rival and teacher and sometime lover, Marlowe, move back and forth between the worlds of Elizabethan England and Faerie and even Hell, a universe in which “the worlds of a great writer can shape the world as a form of magic … {Y]ou’ll find yourself believing that this magic of words is more than a fantasy story.”  All three worlds are masterfully done and I was more than willing to suspend disbelief.  I was caught up in the ongoing crises, crises “that only a handful of individuals, including Shakespeare, can overcome . . . Both Shakespeare and Marlowe . . . must face their own demons, their own mortality, and their own desires if they are find immortality for their own work, and the two kingdoms they come to love.”

And, finally, Hal Duncan offered his own playfully modernized screenplay retelling of As You Like it, free of charge. You can read his explanation of how it came to be, and the first scene in this blog entry, and you can download the whole thing at this site.

That wraps things up for this harrowing monster of a blog post. As I said earlier, I hope that it will be a part of an extended open dialogue. I’d love to hear more from anyone who wants to share their thoughts about this, and I’m especially interested in ideas about how we can use this situation to make our community better and stronger. Please leave a comment here, talk to us on the google group, or email me directly at julia@juliarios.com.

Several OA members on the Google group say they’re planning to attend Arisia and FogCon this year.

Arisia is next weekend, the 14th-17th, in Boston, MA. Cecilia Tan will be hosting a party for Circlet Press on Friday, night, Jennifer Pelland will be reading from her forthcoming novel (with a bisexual protagonist) on Saturday night, and Steve Berman and Connie Wilkins (AKA Sacchi Green, winner of 2010 Lesbian Erotica Lambda) will be hosting an afternoon tea for Lethe Press on Sunday. Catherynne Valente (winner of 2010 Science Fiction/Fantasy/Horror Lambda) will also be attending.

FogCon is the 11th-13th of March in San Francisco, CA. The schedule isn’t set yet, but potential attending members include Chaz Brenchley, Madeleine Robins, Malinda Lo, Cliff Winnig, and Kyell Gold.

There are a lot of other cons in 2011. Which ones are you planning to attend? Let us know in the comments or on the Google group!

But first, on a brief related note: USans can get your free Queer the Census sticker from CREDO Action partnering with the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force.

Coming Out Day posts culled from the mailing list:

• Alex Jeffers posts an excerpt from chapter three of his work in progress the unexpected thing (blog banner mildly NSFW)
• Kyell Gold posts an excerpt from “Waterways”
• Inanna Arthen posts an excerpt from forthcoming novel “The Longer the Fall”
• Katherine Beutner posts on bisexuality in response to Malinda Lo’s essay in “After Ellen“
• K L Richardson posts an excerpt from “Heart Sense”
• Sophie Gail posts an excerpt from her work in stasis
• Hayden Thorne posts a light-hearted excerpt from “Masks: Evolution”
• Mel Green posts on current events in Alaska
• Jarla Tangh posts about her friendships
• Chris / M-BraneSF writes about “a few times in my life where I basically outed myself by other behavior short of a “formal” coming-out”
• Drew talks about Philly Outfest and queer bookshop Giovanni’s Room (image heavy)
• Kevin shares about the night of his Senior Prom
• Natania Barron writes about discovering her POV character was gay
• Alan Yee writes about being semi-out of the closet
• Keffy writes about coming out as trans and his mixed feelings about “Coming Out” day

And more Coming Out Day posts found with a blog search:

• yond_cassius writes a short piece of Coming Out Day spec fic
• Cheryl Morgan posts a roundup of news that has caught her attention this week
• John Coulthart posts a couple of art pieces he’s been working on (mildly NSFW)

If you come across any links to share for next week’s linkdump, please post them to the Outer Alliance forum or bookmark them on delicious or diigo with tag “outeralliancelinks”.

Malinda is a Chinese American lesbian, who is active in LGBTQI and POC (People of Color) awareness efforts. She was managing editor of the lesbian entertainment news site, AfterEllen.com until September of 2008, when she began writing fiction full time.

In addition to keeping a personal journal, Malinda is a member of the 2009 Debutantes LiveJournal community for new YA authors, and a maintainer for The Enchanted Inkpot YA and Middle Grade fantasy community. She lives in Northern California with her partner.

You realized that Ash was a gay character only after you’d written a first draft with her falling for the male prince. Will you actively try to include more queer content in future stories since it’s worked out so well for this one?

Yes. And actually, the first draft of any novel is so different from the final version. I don’t want it to sound like Ash was accidentally queer — I put a lot of thought into the queerness of the retelling. Also, much of Ash was already queer; I just didn’t realize it at first.

Ash’s evolution from straight to gay sort of echoed your own coming out process. Are there other ways in which Ash is like you? Or ways in which she is very different?

I actually don’t think that my coming-out process was like Ash’s at all. Ash did not evolve from straight to gay; she simply fell in love with a woman. I wish my coming-out process had been like that! Mine was much, much more convoluted and involved a lot of therapy and dealing with homophobia. Ash’s experience is truly a fantasy — I hope that more people can simply fall in love with someone, and the gender doesn’t matter at all.

In terms of other similarities or differences … obviously I identify with Ash as a character, but I also identify with her stepmother, and Kaisa, and Sidhean, and her stepsisters. I haven’t lost my parents as Ash did, but I have experienced depression. I’m not trying to marry off a daughter, but I understand the stepmother’s reasons for doing so. So I’m both similar to and different from all the characters in the book.

How long have you known your Lo-Down vlog partner, Sarah Pecora, and how did you meet?

I’ve known Sarah since 2002, I think. We met through mutual friends.

During you career as an entertainment journalist, you’ve met a lot of famous people. Have you ever had a very fannish moment around any of them, or have you always managed to keep your cool?

My most fannish moment occurred when I met Anthony Stewart Head, who played Giles on Buffy the Vampire Slayer. I had no idea I would become such a speechless idiot around him! He is totally charismatic and has that “I’m super cool” vibe that turned me into a total fangirl.

You make no secret of your love for Robin McKinley‘s fairy tale retellings. Can you recommend any other YA authors?

Sure! Kristin Cashore has written two novels that are fantastic: Graceling, about a girl who is gifted with the ability to kill, and Fire (out in October), about an incredibly beautiful woman known as a monster. Cindy Pon has written a really intriguing Asian fantasy called Silver Phoenix, which is full of adventure and based in Chinese myths and legends. Diana Peterfreund’s Rampant, which just came out, is about killer unicorns (seriously awesome) and the virgin hunters who are tasked with killing them.

***

Thanks, Malinda! Look for another Outer Alliance Spotlight post next Friday, and in the meantime, check out Ash: